Chosey Chosen Ones Chose Jiff

[kippurbird]

An interesting thing that got thinking in my head in the regards to the Chosen one in the Fifth Sorceress and other sorts of Chosen Ones.

Tristan kind of Chosen One is the sort where if he's not there the entire world falls apart. The entire world revolves around him and what he has to do. The prophecies all point to him and no one else can do it. Not only that but no matter what he does it'll be correct because he's the Chosen One and Fate has Deemed It So. It takes away a lot of the suspense in the story because you know everything is going to turn out all right. The Chosen One wouldn't be the Chosen One if he didn't save the world, the kingdom, the whatever. And since he is the Chosen One he can't fail because otherwise he wouldn't be the Chosen One. Tristan is the worst sort of Chosen One because the Prophecies say exactly what he's going to do down to the number of weapons he has. They're so exact that they leave no room for error or interpretation. Oh sure he might not know what the prophecies say, but others do and eventually he's supposed to read a book of them that will tell exactly what he's going to do. It's practically a recipe.

The Buffy sort of Chosen One is a bit different. There's a long line of Chosen Ones and it's really a pick of the draw as to who gets to be the Chosen One next. Buffy is also perfectly expendable. There's always someone waiting to take her place (in fact two did show up to take her place). For her being the Chosen One means that she has the abilities needed to go around and kill lots of vampires and other nasty things. How she does it is still up to her and she can still fail. There's no prescribed prophecy that says that Buffy will do such in such. There are prophecies in Buffy but none that actually deal with her. Instead they deal with events outside of her that she has to deal with. That she choses to deal with because she feels that it's her responsibility since no one else can do it.

In Tristan's case he's not choosing to do anything, whatever he does is right. Not only that but he's not doing it because he feels any greater responsibility towards the people. At no point does he ever think "I have to stop them or else the world is doomed" people tell him that but he has no reaction. Instead he has half thoughts about his sister and killing Kludge the man who made him kill his father. It just so happens that this is what he's supposed to do which will end up saving the world. He doesn't chose to, it's just what happens.

Harry Potter is another type of Chosen One. In this case there was a prophecy but it was vague as to who exactly it referred to. Two people, Neville Longbottom and Harry Potter both fit the description of the child in the prophecy however it was Voldemort that made Harry the one in particular that the prophecy talked about. Had he never heard of the prophecy it is likely that he might not have gone after the Potters in the way that he did. Or at least for the specific reason of killing Harry. Harry doesn't even learn about the prophecy until book five. He just thwarts Voldemort, like Buffy, because it's the right thing to do. And when he does learn what the prophecy contains, Dumbledore says that he would probably be doing the same prophecy or not, again because it's the right thing to do and it would make his parents proud.

Chosen Ones can in some cases refer to the ones who bring about change, the best example of this is Darth Vader. He was the Chosen One because he was to bring about a balance in the Force. The way he did that was to become evil and kill all the Jedi, thus making the light no more powerful than the dark. Finally at the end of his life he again balances out the Force by returning to the Light and destroying the Dark. No Jedi thought that it would mean the end of the Order as they knew it because the Chosen One makes it sound like he's supposed to do good, but in this case it's not the politics that he is involved in but in the larger galactic balance that he has been chosen to deal with. These sorts can be good or evil. In Vader's case he ended up being evil. In other cases, where evil is overwhelming the good, the Chosen One may a more traditional hero.

I believe the last sort of Chosen One is the sort that isn't chosen at all. They do what they do because it's what they believe that needs to be done but there's nothing out there that speaks of a person who is supposed to do what they do. Later stories may point to them as being the Chosen One, but as far as they are concerned they are doing what needs to be done. Other people in theory could do the same thing, but its them that choses to do it.

Comments

[christinaathena.livejournal.com]

Also, Buffy was not pure good. Not everything she did was pure and moral. She several times attempted to avoid her fate, and, along with Faith, flirted with the dark side (indeed, Faith did far more than just flirt). Even when Buffy was doing what, in the larger picture, was right, she did many things that were bad on a personal level. Rejected friends, ignored their pain, insisted on her way, etc. Indeed, as Faith shows, Buffy could well have become evil, and she'd still have been the Chosen One.

[kippurbird.livejournal.com]

Yes. This is very true, which makes her a more realistic character, but I don't know if it has to do with her being a Chosen One.

[christinaathena.livejournal.com]

Well, that's kind of my point. :-) Her being a Chosen One didn't come at the expense of a genuine personality.

[smurasaki.livejournal.com]

Tristan is the kind of Chosen One I despise, for exactly the reasons you've pointed out. Plus one that would apply if he didn't have less personality than a triscut - it's not actually a good thing to be that kind of Chosen One. In a likable character it's an awful thing, because not only does it rob them of choice, but it diminishes anything they accomplish because they are, after all, just doing what the prophesies say. Yech.

I think Rowing kind of turned Harry into another version of Chosen One in the last few books - one who was important more for what he was than who he was, which irritated the heck out of me. But, yes, for most of the series he was only nominally a Chosen One.

[last-servant.livejournal.com]

Harry was always the Chosen One, Rowling just called him The-Boy-Who-Lived so it flew under the radar.

After reading the Harry Potter series, I find I really dislike all books after the third. Voldemort just didn't do it for me as a corperal villian.

[smurasaki.livejournal.com]

There were hints that Harry was only "chosen" in Voldemort's mind there in the middle somewhere. But, sadly, she decided to go with boring old traditionally Chosen One in the end. And I had so hoped she wouldn't. :P

[kippurbird.livejournal.com]

Tristan is the kind of Chosen One I despise, for exactly the reasons you've pointed out. Plus one that would apply if he didn't have less personality than a triscut - it's not actually a good thing to be that kind of Chosen One. In a likable character it's an awful thing, because not only does it rob them of choice, but it diminishes anything they accomplish because they are, after all, just doing what the prophesies say. Yech.

Yes. It takes away their ability to make choices good or bad which in turn makes it utterly pointless.

[(Anonymous)]

Wouldn't that make a great Absurdist play though?

Oddly enough, my FOCOPH* has a Prophecy but no Chosen One, i.e. it's assumed that some One will Fulfill it at the designated time, but it's never actually stated By What Thou Shalt Know Him/Her/It.

*Fic o' Crapola On Permanent Hiatus

[last-servant.livejournal.com]

The irony is, if only a Chosen One can save the world, why does the Chooser only make one? Why not an army of Chosen? I'm not thinking of Buffy here, I'm thinking more of Digimon Adventures. There are multiple Chosen Ones, with the numbers exponentially increasing until the Chosen Ones are essentially Chosen to make sure everyone else is Chosen, if that makes any sense at all.

I dislike many parts of the Harry Potter series because he is a Chosen One, and the fact that the series tanks after the standard Chosen One conversation. I like that the prophecy is vague, as prophecies should be, but the vagueness really has no practical effect on the story. He's still a typical Chosen One, complete with the Power Of Love and other annoying tropes.

Personally, I think the whole Anakin as the Chosen One was a snafu for Lucas, but it was still resolved nicely. Did you ever notice that Evil never gets their own prophecies, only mangled versions of the Good prophecies?

The Chosen One trope as a whole isn't bad, and I can still read stories with it, but stories without Chosen Ones can be just as interesting.

And for some reason, I just though of a Series of Unfortunate Events. Huh.

[brightrosefox.livejournal.com]

Oooh, that's a very good point! Now I feel better about having five "Chosen Ones" in my novel, instead of just one. Although one of them is actually meant to destroy the world, which balances out the other four. Although they're not really Chosen. There's no prophecies. It's more like having a responsibility borne out of necessity rather than fate.

[kippurbird.livejournal.com]

The irony is, if only a Chosen One can save the world, why does the Chooser only make one? Why not an army of Chosen?

Because it makes the Hero less special, that's why. In theory you are absolutely correct, but sometimes it's just not practical in writing terms.

Personally, I think the whole Anakin as the Chosen One was a snafu for Lucas, but it was still resolved nicely. Did you ever notice that Evil never gets their own prophecies, only mangled versions of the Good prophecies?

Why do you think it was a snafu?


The Chosen One trope as a whole isn't bad, and I can still read stories with it, but stories without Chosen Ones can be just as interesting.

It isn't, it's just how it's done.

[karma-kalisutah.livejournal.com]

Someday I hope to see a Chosen One who meets the entity that "chose" her and calls bullshit on it.

[karma-kalisutah.livejournal.com]

BTW, I'd never heard that reading of the Darth Vader thing. My Dad just thought "Qui-Gon was a generation off," and I never gave it too much thought myself because... well... thinking about the prequel trilogy hurts my head.

[kippurbird.livejournal.com]

I don't remember where I got particular interpretation of Darth Vader. But it makes sense.

Apparently in the video games there's another Chosen One, Revan who also does a similar thing.

[last-servant.livejournal.com]

No, Revan wasn't Chosen. He got to the top on his own, unlike almost every other super-Jedi/Sith combinations.

[kippurbird.livejournal.com]

*laughs*

*steals the idea for a short story*

[jeriendhal.livejournal.com]

You know what is one of the better takes on the idea of "The Chosen One" and prophecies? Don't laugh (well, do laugh, it's supposed to be a funny game) but it's The Bard's Tale for the PS2. Our Hero finds several Chosen Ones on his path to Free the Princess (tm), and none of them come to a good end.

I like the Buffy sort of Chosen One best, if only because it proves The Powers That Be aren't stupid enough to put all their eggs in one basket. LMB used the same idea in The Curse of Chalion and at one point even has the hero Cazaril wondering, after discovering just how great a series of coincedences have gotten him on the path to breaking the titular curse, "How long have I been on this road, and how many others have come before me?"

[kippurbird.livejournal.com]

The Buffy Chosen One is very good, I think. It makes the most sense to me. If you are going to have a Chosen One you might as well have backup.

[brightrosefox.livejournal.com]

I like this. I like this a lot.
It helps me come to terms with the idea of Chosen Ones in my novel. The characters don't realize what they're meant to be or do, they just do it because they feel it's the best thing to do. Only later do they realize that they're part of a bigger thing -- that it's a kind of heritage, but that they don't necessarily have to accept that fate.
Er. I think I'm confusing myself.
Okay. Female hero develops major powers, and later learns that one of her ancestors had these powers. Not because of genetics, but because outside forces deemed the family line "worthy" of being "chosen." The powers just happen to skip generations depending on the circumstances of the outside forces. Um.
Crap. Am I confusing things again?

The point is, I agree with you that a Chosen One needs to have some sort of fault, or failing point, or something that makes the hero worthy of being chosen, not just because They Were Born That Way And That's How It's Got To Be.

[kippurbird.livejournal.com]

No, you're making sense. You're making perfect sense.

[brightrosefox.livejournal.com]

Oh, good. Sometimes I puzzle myself. These characters have been with me for eight years and they still feel like they have so much more to tell me.

[the-norseman.livejournal.com]

I've never bothered with Chosen Ones, fortunately it's a theme that's mostly gone from Old Norse and Greco-Roman myth. My characters are heroic certainly, and they're often forced to do what they do for reasons beyond their control, but they're not "chosen".

[kippurbird.livejournal.com]

I don't think I have a chosen one either. At least not in the traditional sense.

I rambles at yoooou!

[dove-cg.livejournal.com]

Hee hee. I think you hit the nail on the head. I would like to add that the Chosen One thing works best in a video game, I think. The Player wants to be special and they know the character(s) they control will be doing most of the important plot-based goals, so it's much easier to accept (and if they're bad at the game, they'll die a lot.) It's not an excuse for poor characterization, not by a long shot. But if the cliche ends up being a bit much, fun game mechanics and innovative ideas in overall game concept can make up for that.

Incidentally, I suppose I have a few Chosen Ones but I don't think they're too bad. They do make their own decisions and there are no prophecies about them. They're not really even Chosen Ones but...

One of them is the only known Spirit of the Sun Goddess. Unfortunately, because she's a major voyeur and can't understand or communicate directly with anyone but him, she makes him go through every experience possible (including the horribly painful ones.) Since he is immortal and doesn't die so much as he becomes "unsummoned" from the material plane for an extended period of time (for lack of a better brief description), he can really go through anything without her having to worry about permanently losing her Guinea Pig.

Another was chosen to resurrect the villainess, by the villainess, but that was because he was the son of two members of the original hero party that killed her and he did find out what she was really like... but he went through with resurrecting her in the end, not because he was forced to but because he chose to. :)

The others I dunno... but it's two couples from two seperate stories, who just happen to get mixed up with the right kind of people to set various events of change (mostly bad change) into motion.

... *stops trying to make her characters sound justified* ^_^;

[anarchicq.livejournal.com]

I watched Dark Crystal for the billionth time last night. Jen is a Chosen One, but what kind of Chosen One is he?
Discuss.