And we get more Coded infodumping.
Oct. 8th, 2007 12:26 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
kippurbirdNow that Brown has completely confused the issue ALL together. Anyone know what the big secret is anymore? Anyone? Anyone care? No? Okay.
We're back with the Cell Phone Bishop who's calling America to see if he has any messages. Apparently Cell Phone Bishop doesn't have voice mail. The guy does have messages, but apparently the phone number isn't from the Teacher but instead to the Police. The man on the other end says "I am glad I finally reached you. You and I have much to discuss." GASP! c\~/
Meanwhile back to Teabag and friends.
Apparently scores of historians have been trying to tell the truth about the Holy Grail... and yet no one knows about it. Strange, yes? c\~/
He lists off several books. The Templar Revelation. The woman with the Alabaster Jar, the goddess in the Gospels and of course, Holy blood, Holy grail Which this book is based on. Brown is being clever again. This, Teabag, says is the book that put the idea of the holy grail into the mainstream and isn't it neat that he's using it as the final proof that what they're saying is true? I mean if the book that the book is based on says it's true, it must be true! Or... something like that. c\~/
Brown... I mean Teabag then goes on to assert that there's plenty of historical evidence for this and lots of people know about it but the church still managed to cover it up. This is starting to sound like the church is watching Porn. Everyone knows the church is watching porn, but the church keeps on insisting that it's not watching porn. c\~/
Then Sophie notices a rose on a spine of a book.
Teabag says "That is the Priory symbol for the Grail. Mary Magdalene. because her name was forbidden by the Church, Mary Magdalene became secretly known by many pseudonyms - the Chalice, the Holy Grail, and the Rose." He paused. "The Rose has ties to the five-pointed pentacle of Venus and the guiding Compass Rose. By the way the word rose is identical in English, French, German and many other languages."
"Rose," Langdon added, "Is also an anagram of Eros, the Greek god of sexual love."
Right, so, if Mary Magadalene's name was forbidden by the Church, how come she's in the Gospels? c\~/ And how come people know about her? c\~/ (Oh wait it's because everyone knows about it despite the cover up...). Then there's the bit about Rose being identical in English, French and German etc. Now I know that German and English are Germanic languages and French is a Romantic. The fact that the two of them have the same word for rose is probably from cross pollution. And I highly doubt Eros was spelled "E R O S" in Greek. So that makes the anagram completely and utterly useless. c\~/
Then we talk about how the blossoming flower is a symbol for female genitalia. c\~/
Finally we learn that Mary and child where smuggled to Gaul (or France and hidden within a Jewish Community.) There her linage was apparently deeply documented because she came from the line of kings and was considered royalty. Uh-huh. Yeah right. We're not really all that blood line obsessed. If we were, then we'd still have the lines of David etc. And I think we pretty much gave up on the idea of having a king, so we wouldn't really bother to keep up with that. The Jews there, however, were apparently very impressed with the fact that Sarah (that's the baby's name) came from the line of kings. And from what I can figure out Jews weren't even IN Gaul until after the Second Temple was destroyed. So, I don't know what Jewish Community Mary went to. c\~/, c\~/, c\~/
And so they kept a family tree. And Sophie is like, well how can you confirm the authenticity of the family tree. And Teabag returns that you can as much as the bible. Yes, but no one is trying to claim that the bible is authentic ... at least the Old Testament. I can't speak for the New one. But then apparently history is written by the winners and the Priory Documents are the other side of the story. Blah, blah, blah. Holy Grail is a tomb. To kneel at the grail was to kneel at the tomb and not be searching for the Feminine mystique c\~/ c\~/ Blah Christ's line married into a French Royal line which created the line known as the Merovingian blood line.
Right. so, here's the thing. Mary fled to Gaul and had the baby there. Therefor she couldn't have been that pregnant when she left. And it's highly unlikely that she would have told anyone that she was pregnant. So how did other people know? How did the Church know? If she went into hiding before there was a church? There was no reason for her to flee... because the Church wasn't going to come after her... because it didn't exist... and Jesus was just some Jew, you know? In fact the entire idea of Jesus not being divine (according to Brown) didn't even happen until centuries later when the bloodline or even knowledge of it would have been completely lost. So there was no reason for her to hide the child. c\~/ c\~/
Sophie gets a chill as she realizes that there are descendants of Jesus who live on in modern times. She then remembers that her grandfather wanted to talk to her about her family and the truth. And then she remembers the fact that her grandfather called her Princess Sophie...
Could this be foreshadowing I see?
Why, yes, I think it is! c\~/
Remy, the butler, then asks to see Teabag. He goes off with some snappy dialog, leaving Sophie and Langdon alone.
We've just had sixteen pages of infodumping. Sixteen pages of infodump and the plot has completely stalled. Silas and the police are probably sitting around wanking off because of the amount of time it's taking for them to respond. All sense of urgency, of the fact that they're fugitives has been completely forgotten as they casually talk about the Grail as if it were a school lecture or something. Reading it I've completely forgotten the fact that there's a gun totting albino out to kill them all and that the police are looking for them. In this sort of book that's not what you want your reader to do. As mentioned before, it kills the tension. No tension, no reason to move on. For these past pages our heroes haven't been in danger. Or at least felt like they were in danger.
Oh. You get the point.
Drinks: 16
We're back with the Cell Phone Bishop who's calling America to see if he has any messages. Apparently Cell Phone Bishop doesn't have voice mail. The guy does have messages, but apparently the phone number isn't from the Teacher but instead to the Police. The man on the other end says "I am glad I finally reached you. You and I have much to discuss." GASP! c\~/
Meanwhile back to Teabag and friends.
Apparently scores of historians have been trying to tell the truth about the Holy Grail... and yet no one knows about it. Strange, yes? c\~/
He lists off several books. The Templar Revelation. The woman with the Alabaster Jar, the goddess in the Gospels and of course, Holy blood, Holy grail Which this book is based on. Brown is being clever again. This, Teabag, says is the book that put the idea of the holy grail into the mainstream and isn't it neat that he's using it as the final proof that what they're saying is true? I mean if the book that the book is based on says it's true, it must be true! Or... something like that. c\~/
Brown... I mean Teabag then goes on to assert that there's plenty of historical evidence for this and lots of people know about it but the church still managed to cover it up. This is starting to sound like the church is watching Porn. Everyone knows the church is watching porn, but the church keeps on insisting that it's not watching porn. c\~/
Then Sophie notices a rose on a spine of a book.
Teabag says "That is the Priory symbol for the Grail. Mary Magdalene. because her name was forbidden by the Church, Mary Magdalene became secretly known by many pseudonyms - the Chalice, the Holy Grail, and the Rose." He paused. "The Rose has ties to the five-pointed pentacle of Venus and the guiding Compass Rose. By the way the word rose is identical in English, French, German and many other languages."
"Rose," Langdon added, "Is also an anagram of Eros, the Greek god of sexual love."
Right, so, if Mary Magadalene's name was forbidden by the Church, how come she's in the Gospels? c\~/ And how come people know about her? c\~/ (Oh wait it's because everyone knows about it despite the cover up...). Then there's the bit about Rose being identical in English, French and German etc. Now I know that German and English are Germanic languages and French is a Romantic. The fact that the two of them have the same word for rose is probably from cross pollution. And I highly doubt Eros was spelled "E R O S" in Greek. So that makes the anagram completely and utterly useless. c\~/
Then we talk about how the blossoming flower is a symbol for female genitalia. c\~/
Finally we learn that Mary and child where smuggled to Gaul (or France and hidden within a Jewish Community.) There her linage was apparently deeply documented because she came from the line of kings and was considered royalty. Uh-huh. Yeah right. We're not really all that blood line obsessed. If we were, then we'd still have the lines of David etc. And I think we pretty much gave up on the idea of having a king, so we wouldn't really bother to keep up with that. The Jews there, however, were apparently very impressed with the fact that Sarah (that's the baby's name) came from the line of kings. And from what I can figure out Jews weren't even IN Gaul until after the Second Temple was destroyed. So, I don't know what Jewish Community Mary went to. c\~/, c\~/, c\~/
And so they kept a family tree. And Sophie is like, well how can you confirm the authenticity of the family tree. And Teabag returns that you can as much as the bible. Yes, but no one is trying to claim that the bible is authentic ... at least the Old Testament. I can't speak for the New one. But then apparently history is written by the winners and the Priory Documents are the other side of the story. Blah, blah, blah. Holy Grail is a tomb. To kneel at the grail was to kneel at the tomb and not be searching for the Feminine mystique c\~/ c\~/ Blah Christ's line married into a French Royal line which created the line known as the Merovingian blood line.
Right. so, here's the thing. Mary fled to Gaul and had the baby there. Therefor she couldn't have been that pregnant when she left. And it's highly unlikely that she would have told anyone that she was pregnant. So how did other people know? How did the Church know? If she went into hiding before there was a church? There was no reason for her to flee... because the Church wasn't going to come after her... because it didn't exist... and Jesus was just some Jew, you know? In fact the entire idea of Jesus not being divine (according to Brown) didn't even happen until centuries later when the bloodline or even knowledge of it would have been completely lost. So there was no reason for her to hide the child. c\~/ c\~/
Sophie gets a chill as she realizes that there are descendants of Jesus who live on in modern times. She then remembers that her grandfather wanted to talk to her about her family and the truth. And then she remembers the fact that her grandfather called her Princess Sophie...
Could this be foreshadowing I see?
The words hung in the huge space, and Sophie felt and odd vibration, as if her bones were reverberating with some new kind of truth. Descendants of Jesus who survived into modern times. Her grandfather's voice agin was whispering in her ear. Princess, I must tell you the truth about your family.
A chill raked her flesh.
Royal blood.
She could not imagine.
Princess Sophie.
Why, yes, I think it is! c\~/
Remy, the butler, then asks to see Teabag. He goes off with some snappy dialog, leaving Sophie and Langdon alone.
We've just had sixteen pages of infodumping. Sixteen pages of infodump and the plot has completely stalled. Silas and the police are probably sitting around wanking off because of the amount of time it's taking for them to respond. All sense of urgency, of the fact that they're fugitives has been completely forgotten as they casually talk about the Grail as if it were a school lecture or something. Reading it I've completely forgotten the fact that there's a gun totting albino out to kill them all and that the police are looking for them. In this sort of book that's not what you want your reader to do. As mentioned before, it kills the tension. No tension, no reason to move on. For these past pages our heroes haven't been in danger. Or at least felt like they were in danger.
Oh. You get the point.
Drinks: 16
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no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 08:25 am (UTC)He's got the wrong Mary. The rose is the symbol for Mary, Mother of Jesus.
http://campus.udayton.edu/mary/rosarymarkings36.html
no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 08:27 am (UTC)The thorns=crown of thorns
Red color=blood shed in his sacrifice
no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 04:49 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-10-09 01:39 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-10-09 02:36 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 08:37 am (UTC)The English word rose comes from Latin and Old French. Latin rosa may be an Etruscan form of Greek Rhodia, “Rhodian, originating from Rhodes.” The Attic Greek word for rose is rhodon, and in Sappho's Aeolic dialect of Greek it is wrodon.
So not only is Rose come from Rosa, which isn't an anagram, but a Latin one at that. And the Latin name for Eros is... Cupid. And to add to this, the Greek word for Rose appears to be "From Rhodes"! So Brown fails on all counts, no matter which language you choose. If you go with Latin, Rosa isnt Cupid, and if you go with Greek, Rhodon isn't Eros.
Say, have you ever watched Pi? I think it'd be a good way to detox from Code. It's like the Anti-code, really. Higher math, stock markets, Kabbalah, and migraine-induced hallucination.
no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 01:03 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 04:52 pm (UTC)I've heard of PI, haven't had a chance to see it yet though.
no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 09:29 pm (UTC)Do go see Pi. Yes, it's math-focused instead of english, but everything Code does wrong, Pi does right. When I see all the stretches of logic Brown makes, I'm reminded of what Sol says: "As soon as you discard scientific rigor, you're no longer a mathematician, you're a numerologist."
That and it's got a wonderful B&W indie flavor to it; Especially the camera effects. Oh, and mustn't forget the power drill.
no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 04:04 pm (UTC)With foreshadowing like that how did people think there was any mystery to this book?
no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 04:54 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 05:25 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-10-09 01:41 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 04:07 pm (UTC)This made me nearly spit coffee all over my screen. Is the Church my shady next door neighbor?
Could this be foreshadowing I see?...Why, yes, I think it is!
It's the most heavy-handed foreshadowing I've ever seen, as a matter of fact. What I don't understand is why Brown would want to give away the "big surprise ending" this early in the game. Not only is it dumb, it's cliche. You see it all the time in fantasy/scifi: "Oooh, we're on a quest to find a secret holy/sacred/powerful artifact, I wonder if one of us who is seeking it is actually the prophesied rightful owner of it/royalty from a long-lost bloodline?" Duh.
no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 04:57 pm (UTC)Yay for spit-takes! And probably.
It's the most heavy-handed foreshadowing I've ever seen, as a matter of fact. What I don't understand is why Brown would want to give away the "big surprise ending" this early in the game. Not only is it dumb, it's cliche. You see it all the time in fantasy/scifi: "Oooh, we're on a quest to find a secret holy/sacred/powerful artifact, I wonder if one of us who is seeking it is actually the prophesied rightful owner of it/royalty from a long-lost bloodline?" Duh.
Yeaaaaah. Amazing coincidences that one. Someone should write a story where they have to find the shiny magical object AND the prophesied one.
no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 06:13 pm (UTC)Of course, the saner solution would be to come up with a surprise ending that's actually surprising. But he really can't be bothered.
no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 07:29 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 09:16 pm (UTC)Moreover the rose also occurs in alchemy, sometimes as a code for Ros that is dew, heavenly dew, tartar etc. In short there are word plays involving roses, but they have nothing to do with eros.
White, Red and Golden roses are also closely linked to alchemy, but the precise spiritual meanings are a bit beyond me I fear. They can refer to various stages in alchemy, the completion of alchemy (golden rose), or your inner spiritual self (red rose).
It can also refer to love, but since this is alchemy this is the kind of love that transmutes, that changes you into something else. Sublime, spiritual love. Not kinky sex parties in dark basements, not a generic "sacred feminine," but a specific love.
However I can't go into details since I'm an amateur, a dabbler in all of this.
no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 09:38 pm (UTC)!ronChef Foicite: well, there's a lot of reasons
IronChef Foicite: i mean, roses only last like a couple weeks
IronChef Foicite: and that's if you leave them in water
IronChef Foicite: and they really only exist to be pretty
IronChef Foicite: so that's like saying
IronChef Foicite: "my love for you is transitory and based solely on your appearance"
IronChef Foicite: but a potato!
IronChef Foicite: potatos last for fucking ever, man
IronChef Foicite: in fact, not only will they not rot, they actually grow shit even if you just leave them in the sack
IronChef Foicite: that part alone makes it a good symbol
IronChef Foicite: but there's more!
IronChef Foicite: there are so many ways to enjoy a potato! you can even make a battery with it!
IronChef Foicite: and that's like saying "i have many ways in which I show my love for you"
IronChef Foicite: and potatos may be ugly, but they're still awesome
IronChef Foicite: so that's like saying "it doesn't matter at all what you look like, I'll still love you"
I vote that all the rose imagery in Code gets substituted with potatoes. It'll probably make the story better, too.
no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 11:04 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 11:23 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 08:33 pm (UTC)OMFG THE SUSPENSE!
no subject
Date: 2007-10-09 02:45 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-10-08 09:40 pm (UTC)I could write a few paragraphs on why is stupid to make Sophie the descendent of Christ, but, considering the level of WTF-ness of everything, I´d probably be wasting my brain.
So I´ll just say that, in my language, Rose is Rosa. u.u
no subject
Date: 2007-10-09 02:47 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-10-09 02:48 am (UTC)How´s that for sacred feminine? IN UR FACE, GREEK MITHOLOGY!
Or something.
no subject
Date: 2007-10-09 03:38 am (UTC)